You may recall there’s a group out of Detroit (my hometown) that is collaborating with singers to create Deaf music videos.
D-Pan has now released another one, and this time they’re Waiting on the World to Change
The first video they released was “Where’d you go”. Some said it wasn’t ASL enough, but is this one too ASL? I’m not sure how I feel about it.
(Bonus points if you can pick out my mom.)
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Yeah I can see your mom Peppy :) I see few my friends on the video. I heard about the music video done by deaf people but didn’t see it till today. It looks professionally done with same caliber as hearing music videos. Well done! One thing is why do Deaf need to know music ? We ain’t missing out on music cuz we are born deaf. It’s like taking a blind person to the art museum. My son does music Trombone and I feel vibrations and noises. That’s about it.
What’s too little ASL or too much ASL ???
How can we Deaf people be judged with our ASL skills ? If we can communicate with each other and understand even if our ASL is not that great maybe PSL or even SEE. It’s just another forms of communication. ASL is not the only language in this world…there is BSL, LSQ, Chinese, Brazillian, Norweigian, African sign language around the world. There is slang signs or even new signs from time to time. ASL in California or Florida is bit different from Michigan. If you don’t understand…simply ask to clarify and you will cross that bridge eventually.
That’s why sign language is beautiful…it’s not etched in stone. It changes thru time and we adapt to it from generation to generation. We cherish it and share it to the world!
good Detroit News article explaining D-PAN: http://www.detnews.com/apps/pb...../707130400
You may notice a great looking guy in this picture- on the far right. That’s my brother John. Pencil in a goatee and you might see the resemblance between us.
all these comments make me laugh…. art is art…. no one says we have to appreciate what others may percieve as art. I’ll leave it at that.
David….. your brother is one ugly duckling ;)
Don’t be quick to assume that all Deaf people don’t need or don’t enjoy music…there are those of us who do. I was born severely deaf myself, but I still do have ***some*** residual hearing, and I know people who even thought they are profoundly deaf themselves, still do get something from music…even if it is just vibrations, or watching someone translate the lyrics into sign language or seeing them via captions/subtitles.
This was a nicely made video, I agree. Sorry, David… I couldn’t pick out your mom, so I guess I failed to score any bonus points.
However, truthfully…the video didn’t really do much for me. Maybe it’s because I don’t have speakers on my computer and am not wearing my hearing aids, thus I can’t hear the music…(I do think that music for Deaf people works better in person, where they can really feel and experience it). But this video didn’t jazz me up and get my feet tapping or make me feel inspired or whatever. It felt more like an “advertisement” than anything else. Okay…to a certain extent that is what music videos are - advertising a musician’s song. But it wasn’t really that entertaining, although I did enjoy see the little toddler signing, etc.
Maybe it’s me…maybe it’s just that I didn’t find the lyrics all that exciting. I mean, the message is a well-intentioned and well-meaning one, but it seemed rather repetitious…how many times do they say “waiting for the world to change?”
Was it too much ASL? I can see why you might feel that way, David. I am a bit more of a PSE advocate for signing music myself- while I don’t want pure SEE-type signs, I do like to get more of a sense of the actual lyrics than I felt was being shown here. I also like a bit more mouthing than what I saw going on here.
But again, that’s my own personal preference.
I don’t know…I’m with David on this one - not sure how I feel about it. I definitely give it an A for effort…but not know how I would grade the final product.
blue shirt, black blazer?
No speakers here at work and no earphones to listen with, but I found it honestly too slow and repetitive and pointless after a while…
Okay, I just looked up the lyrics. I feel totally cheated now. That video was NOT an interpretation.
Hilary,
I wonder where exactly you feel cheated? I thought they did a Terrific job!
I’ve been interpreting for 20+ years, and have I yet to see the same interpretation of any spoken words, let alone musical lyrics. (Not even the National Anthem!)
I feel that the intent of the words come through.
For example, the part of the song that says “When you trust your television what you get is what you got Cause when they own the information, They can bend it all they want” - - the ASL version is signed, “TV, watch trust.. story true?? oh i see they decide fool us” - Any suggestions on a better interpretation?
Thats a rhetorical question, but I’d love to hear suggestions! The translations were a “working document” and not finalized until the day before - open to feedback from each of the Deaf people involved. I think that is the key here, native ASL users took part in the interpretation and used their own experience of “Waiting on the World to change” to choose the lyrics they were most comfortable with that also fit the timing of the music! THAT was a challenge.
Oh by the way Bret - the lyrics regarding the yellow ribbon say “If we had the power to bring our neighbours home from war, they would have never missed a Christmas - No more Ribbons on the door” unfortunately we would have taken REAL creative liberty to make that line fit the Deaf community - That may not fly! A suggestion might have been an ASL version of “If we had the power to choose our own leaders, no more Tent City and No more carting off 100 Deaf protesters to jail” … or something like that :)
Maybe when the world changes, and oppression is not such a daily thing - we can stop ripping on eachother too! (No Hilary - that is NOT directed at you :) )
Kudos to D-Pan! Sean, Ron, John, Scott, Joel and QUIG - you guys ROCK!!!!
My issue was more with changing the original intent/content of the song — the original song is about bringing soldiers home from war. Don’t get me wrong. I thought the signing, etc., was great, though I felt it was too repetitive (then I read the lyrics and saw they were repetitive too).
Honestly, it just seemed more like a PSA than a music video to me.
But that’s just me. :)
I guess we are just two peas in a pod, Hilary…my sentiments are pretty much along the same lines as yours.
I too thought it was a nicely made video and the signing itself was great, etc….but I also felt it was too repetitive and had too much of that PSA feel to it.
Guess it’s just you and me against the world, sistah.
(Personally, I think we’re gonna get creamed. ***wink***)
Your comment just reminded me of another song that I love — one that I think D-PAN would do well with…
You and me against the world
Sometimes it feels like you and me against the world
When all the others turn their backs and walk away
You can count on me to stay….
An amazing Helen Reddy song.
http://superseventies.com/sl_youandmeagainst.html
“And when one of us is gone
And one of us is left to carry on
Then remembering will have to do
Our memories alone will get us through
Think about the days of me and you
Of you and me against the world…”
Yup, know the song well.
In fact, I used to perform it in a sign-song group I was in at Gally, and in more recent years as well.
I agree, it’s an amazing song…sistah.
i second that… that was a nice and sad song…
Hilary,
This is how amazing the power of perspective is… I totally disagree that the song is about bringing soliders home from war. I view that as one verse in the song. I think the song is about oppression. Oppression from the power of the media, Oppression through politics, etc…
The lyrics in the opening verse say
”
Me and all my friends
We’re all misunderstood
They say we stand for nothing and
There’s no way we ever could
Now we see everything is going wrong
With the world and those who lead it
We just feel like we don’t have the means
To rise above and beat it ”
I dont think that verse is specific to war.
Cheers to the power of perspective?! :)
Becky
read my earlier post.
“I read this lyric and it’s kinda political/activist or anti-war song”
It’s not entirely about war.
Yes the media played the role in engaging the Afghanstian and Iraq war influencing the American masses with Bush’s lies. WMDs ?? There were none. Uranium purchases from Sudan to Iraq…it was faked documents. Now, do we rely on U.S. news for reliable sources. Which is more true or false ? U.S. gov’t keep blaming Iran on supporting and supplying terrorists in Iraq but they never had hard concrete proof of it. Did they catch a truckload of weapons crossing from Iran to Iraq? There was none of it. Still U.S. gov’t insists on it.
White House uses media as their tool.
Media is powerful tool for government’s propaganda.
Oh, but Hilary… That video IS an interpretation, just not yours ;)
I watched another video on D-Pan’s site, this one done by the Ghetto Hand Boyz from Houston, TX.
http://www.d-pan.com/index.php.....;Itemid=35
Growing up in the ghetto I wasn’t one of the suburbanites that liked rap, I was one that lived rap. NWA, X-Clan, Eazy E, Public Enemy. Nowadays, it’s not so much my thing, but it has it’s moments of brilliance.
It’s still art, remember?
I thought it was awesome!!! :)
I did look at the lyrics and music can be interpreted in any way to a listener.
Eddie Vedder said he didn’t want to explain his songs because he wanted the songs to be left up to the listeners, making them “part-owners” of the songs! :)
That said, I think they did a GREAT job!!!
I am just sorry I totally chickened out…I don’t have much confidence to sign my favorite Pearl Jam songs in ASL. ;)
Anyway, I look forward to more! And it’s right in my home state! :D
Yes!!!
Oh, I don’t know you or your mom…so I’m just going to take a shot in the dark - the lady with the Victorian house in the background?? ;)
Thanks for the heads up on the new video! :D
It was all right. Good camera work - I liked that part best.
And as for the rap video, ew.
When Ron Dans explains D-PAN as in Deaf Performing Arts Network.
What’s Deaf Performing Arts means to you ? Is it just music? What about acting? Dancing ? using music instruments? Something you perform in ? Poetry? Magic show ? Comedian ?
They sounds like it’s only limited to music. Not all Deaf is into music. I am not. I was like so what ? It’s more for hard of hearing or deafened people who still retains their love to music. I don’t know many Deaf that goes bananas over music. Except for IAMMINE :P with Pearl Jam (gags) :F
Hahaha, Bret… :P
Oh hush… some deaf people do enjoy music!!!
I grew up loving music and I was a MTV freak!!!
;)
Some people just don’t get music - not just the deaf, but even hearing people! Some of them do not appreciate music.
Ron Dans can’t sing at all lol. I tried to see what he was saying…miss miss christmas or tree ??? …something tied… I don’t know what the wordings is except the repeating “waiting for world to change” Kinda ruined the whole point of the video when you don’t get what the heck they saying.
Little girl signing was so cute!
And there was only 9 seconds to sign the words “If we had the power to bring our neighbours home from war, they would’ve never missed a Christmas - no more ribbons on the door.”
In a perfect world, we’d tell John Mayer to slow the timing of those lines down.. hee hee!
Why don’t they name their organization D-MN …Deaf Music Network ?
I can see why they would hesitate from using it cuz people would associate the organization to the word DAMN! ;)
;)
DMN is how you say damn. So yeah, not gonna happen. :)
*laugh* Prob with D-PAN is that to pan is somewhat synonymous with to criticize, as in “The critics panned “Waiting on the World to Change.” So I don’t think it’s a good choice either. ;)
D-Pan would associate with Dead Pan heh couldn’t resist to bring that up…I am a comedian so…. dead pan would mean expressionless face.
Ah thanks for the explaination…of the lyric. I didn’t see any of that being said and i was clueless.
If have power bring soldiers home won’t miss Christmas again would have made clearer. I don’t know why it says neighbors from war ? I thought you meant soldiers. Our soldiers!
Ya know many deaf is not good with cryptic messages or between the lines meeting or most idioms. Deaf people prefer CLEAR message. What is ribbon all about ? I know yellow ribbons got to do with soliders in Iraq so that’s about it.
This is hearing song so when are deaf gonna create their own songs. Where is their creativity and talents. Enough with trying to translate or mimic and follow hearing songs.
Wish got power can gather our soldiers home no more war no more miss christmas. No more ribbons!
That would make sense :)
Peace
“many deaf is not good with cryptic messages or between lines meeting or most idions”…. Frankly, I find that statement somewhat misleading.
I do not know the exactly suggestion or implication of your part, however, for the sake of clarification I want to pitch something in…
If by “many” you want to take “numbers” into factor as determining the larger majority that does not understand subtle message, then I will partially agree with you on that term. However, if you take the factor into consideration with the hearing population, you will find astounding many hearing people are “not good with cryptic messages or between the lines meeting or most idioms”.
Your statement leaves an assumption that, unlike “many Deaf”, many hearing are good with subtle messages. Given the current society’s view of the Deaf, this statement will be taken as a deliberate valid point without considering the others (such as hearing people). That’s why I found this statement somewhat misleading.
I know what I am talking about. Analyze my comments all you want. That won’t change my opinion and my experience growing up as Deaf person and living in Deaf community all my life. I know what I seen and know what they been thru with lousy education they put up with.
Words they don’t care unless expressed in ASL properly they will understand.
Why can’t they make songs about lousy education and discrimination they had been handed down from the gov’t and board of education. That will be cool song cuz it will reflect our deaf struggle to make our life better living. Tired of handing out diplomas like toilet paper to deaf people who couldn’t make it to college or find a job. Tired of Deaf applying for SSDI or SS where there is no job available or denied to them.
See there’s an idea for a song that can evoke emotion because many Deaf will connect due to their similiar experiences. I don’t need to hear those hearing songs cuz it’s not about us Deaf people.
Am waiting for someone to create it and put it on music video would be great!. I would put my two cents in.(wink)(that’s idiom to ya)
Bret, most people where I live don’t even sign ASL. They graduated high school not with a high school diploma, but with a certificate of attendance. And most of them are on some form of SSI. Many are also drug and alcohol abusers.
Does that mean the rest of the deaf community in the United States are like my local deaf community?
No, it does not. But you know, a song about people like that would be good. It would show the devastating effect of the educational system has done to us. We still have a very strong Oral program here and most of us agree that the Oral program is one major reason why the deaf community is in such shambles.
It was not my intention to change your opinions or thoughts on the subject, I was merely hoping you would clarify.
Beautiful job! Kudos to D-PAN and the people involved in its production.
I am just pitching in my 2 cents…
Bret asks a good question “How can we Deaf people be judged with our ASL skills ?” I would like to answer the question.
Bear in mind, ASL, like many spoken languages such as English, is a language with its lingustic structures. As many of us to recall taking English classes throughout my academic life, and we have been criticized with the dreadful red pens by our teachers/professors. While we are being criticized, we are also being judged for our usage of English.
Why were our English being criticized? It is simply because English has certain lingustic rules and structures that we “must” comply.
ASL, too, has certain lingustic rules and structures; thus, it hereby allows us to judge one’s usage of ASL. I know the answer may be insufficient to some of you, so ask if you wished that I should elaborate.
The lyrics:
Waiting On The World To Change lyrics by John Mayer.
me and all my friends
we’re all misunderstood
they say we stand for nothing and
there’s no way we ever could
now we see everything that’s going wrong
with the world and those who lead it
we just feel like we don’t have the means
to rise above and beat it
so we keep waiting
waiting on the world to change
we keep on waiting
waiting on the world to change
it’s hard to beat the system
when we’re standing at a distance
so we keep waiting
waiting on the world to change
now if we had the power
to bring our neighbors home from war
they would have never missed a Christmas
no more ribbons on their door
and when you trust your television
what you get is what you got
cause when they own the information, oh
they can bend it all they want
that’s why we’re waiting
waiting on the world to change
we keep on waiting
waiting on the world to change
it’s not that we don’t care,
we just know that the fight ain’t fair
so we keep on waiting
waiting on the world to change
and we’re still waiting
waiting on the world to change
we keep on waiting waiting on the world to change
one day our generation
is gonna rule the population
so we keep on waiting
waiting on the world to change
we keep on waiting
waiting on the world to change
Thanks for the lyrics Hilary. Now that makes sense to me reading than those on ASL video. Sorry. I guess that video is just eye candy but understanding what they say is other story. It’s not just music cuz you have to understand the feeling and the words it says. I read this lyric and it’s kinda political/activist or anti-war song. People are fed up with the gov’t and their wars. We try to fight the system with the gov’t but it’s hard so we end up waiting for the world to change. Meaning that we wait till the next new president with George Bush gone in 2008 and hoping things will improve with better foreign policy. If not, we wait for next new president or Iraq to improve. We are still waiting. We wait til something better comes along. Why fight the system it’s too hard they won’t change so we wait for the world to change.
Kudos
That’s why I felt cheated when I saw the lyrics after watching the video. I felt like the video wasn’t related to the intent of the song, which is essentially anti-war/anti-government. I just feel like the video is too much of a stretch. That’s MY interpretation. (*grins at DS*)
I’d much rather see a video that’s about empowerment and taking action than being passive. But that’s just me. :)
I happen to agree with JJ here…
You may be right in your view that you have been cheated by the song… but i dont know if you know…. but anytime when you translate one language into another… lost in translation automatically occur, which may affect the “interpretation”.
For instance, in america… we say “good morning, good afternoon, and good night”… In French, they dont say those… because those expressions are not part of their culture… in fact that simpyl say “bonjour”.. but when you “translate” the ‘bonjour’ immediately you get a “good day”… but it is not the “correct” interpretation of French word that is somewhat equivalent to our “good morning” etc…
With that say, although there are clear indications of lost in translation, the message remains the same… It is about, as the title says it all, waiting for the world to change… it is about feeling “vulnerable” and yet “hopeful”… The D-Pan video reflects the underlying message of Mr. Mayer…
Oh, I’m well aware of the pitfalls that occur in interpretation and translation. But when you take one song that’s clearly about one thing and try to adapt it to an entirely different situation, you’re not just dealing with cultural and translation issues. You’re changing the original INTENT and message of the song. That’s where I balk.
To me, it’s one thing to play with languages and have fun with them. It’s another to take an entire song and try to force it to apply to a different theme.
As an aside… did John Mayer approve of his lyrics being used for this video? Just a random, sudden thought here.
I am confident that John Mayer has given his approval, as implied in Detroit news (http://detnews.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070713/ENT01/707130400/1032/ENT).
I think we may differ on the intention of the lyric, thus… I am curious… what do you think was Mr. Mayer’s intention?
Now you are speaking my language Hilary!!
Yes that’s exactly my sentiment toward that video. I thought the video has something to do with deaf culture or deaf history…when I read the lyric and it got absolutely nothing to do with us. I re-read the lyric and it says they are waiting for the world to change. Well how long do we have to wait for them to do something about our poor education, job discrimination, cultural oppression, technologically advanced C.I., etc. Hell we ain’t waiting for those hearing people. We got to fight and get their attention. We have been here since the 1700’s and it had not changed much in past 200 years and we ain’t gonna wait another 200 years for them to take notice.
Bret,
That’s an interesting response to D-PAN the video. I just read the lyrics and you have a valid point.
I agree with you on this one… I cannot blame you for such an assumption, for I share similar “thought”…
However, if you analyze the song to its extent… you will realize it is really somewhat resonate the experience and struggles we, as Deaf persons, deal with on daily basis… The video may not say it explicitly, but it does say it implicitly.
Nice to know someone else agrees with me. :) Even if we are in the minority here… *heh*
I thought this video was a great creative outlet and quite artistically made. Even though the original lyrics are a completely different subject/topic, the message is the same. We can all appreciate the portrayal of our struggles and adversaries faced as deaf people. That in itself is no reason to feel “cheated” or whatnot. Appreciate the orginial song and the application of that message to our everyday lives. You Rock Mr. Forbes :-)
I’m curious…has John Mayer or anyone made a music video of this song so we can see how THEY are interpreting the lyrics? Are they in fact using an anti-war/anti-government approach in their own videos?
Just thought it would be interesting to see other takes on this song and its lyrics…
John Mayer made a video for his song and he doesnt necessarily base it all on an anti-war/government theme. If you watch the video you will see he kinda incorporates the message on a personal level- showing different people from different walks of life.
Yeah, well… some people read what it is while others can interpret it differently.
For example, about missing no more Christmases and no more yellow ribbons…
I could interpret it related to this D-PAN video:
No more missing Christmas = no more missing important conversations with hearing family members if everyone knew ASL.
No more yellow ribbons = no more of need in reminding people to support ASL in education or teaching their children (both deaf and hearing) ASL from birth – again because it would be a language acquired by most.
That’s *MY* interpretation. ;)
I like YOUR interpretation! There was thought as to how “explicit” the translation could be to make it directly related to the Deaf experience. and YOUR interpretation would be Awesome!
LOL
I enjoyed the “Waiting On The World To Change” video as done by D-PAN. My son usually doesn’t want to discuss sign language or things like that with me,..but he paid attention to the D-PAN video and understood that the signers weren’t signing the “words,”..but signing out how they experienced the concepts behind the words. He and I both agreed that the video would be an excellent teaching tool for opening people’s eyes about how the Deaf are regarded by many Hearing people.
Thanks,
Stanelle
This is strictly my wife’s comment here so I am just typing in what she said. Who is “we”? Who is the “world”? My wife has her own thought about this and was curious how some of you would define “world” and “we”.