After getting into an argument last week with someone who believes that ASL-using, culturally Deaf people are “insular,” I took the time to look the word up. I had always assumed it just meant “insulated” or “closed.” But when you know you’ll probably be having the same argument again in the near future, it’s a good idea to prepare for it with precise definitions. So here are a few that I found for “insular” using a Google search:
• relating to or characteristic of or situated on an island; “insular territories”; “Hawaii’s insular culture”
• suggestive of the isolated life of an island; “an exceedingly insular man; so deeply private as to seem inaccessible to the scrutiny of a novelist”- Leonard Michaels
• narrowly restricted in outlook or scope; “little sympathy with parochial mentality”; “insular attitudes toward foreigners”
• either of an island, or suggestive of the isolated condition of an island
Strange, isn’t it, how the word “island” is mentioned again and again. So for the hell of it I looked this up as well, since it seems so central to the concept of “insular.” This is one of the definitions I found:
• a body of land surrounded by water on all sides
Now taken together these meanings strike me as somewhat incompatible. Do you notice how none of the definitions for “insular” seem to mention what people who live on islands are isolated from? Or what those islanders have narrowly restricted their collective outlook or scope to exclude? Certainly the definition of “island” alone doesn’t tell us these things. It seems foolish to assume that islanders have isolated themselves from the knowledge that they’re surrounded on all sides by water. If I’m wrong on this, the following experiment should resolve the situation: We’ll simply ask a dozen fishermen randomly selected from a dozen islands if they indeed strive to exclude the existence of water from their outlook on life. Their answers should tell us what we need to know.
I also have a somewhat hard time figuring out why life on an island—solely by virtue of the fact that it exists on an island—is “isolated.” Especially when you consider that human life doesn’t really reproduce itself very well when a human being is alone. Thus if there’s a human society on an island at all, isn’t its very existence direct evidence of the fact that at least some of these islanders got together long enough to dispel their isolation?
Not that any of these things matter, of course. It’s a good bet that the term “insular” has less to do with people who live on islands and more to do with people who came to these islands long ago in huge ships armed with cannon and guns. In fact, before they showed up, based on the definitions above there probably wasn’t an islander in the ocean who believed that he had an insularity problem. It’s also a good bet that he only became convinced he had one after the captain of one of these ships pointed a cannon at him and told him that he had one.
But I’m not arguing here that “insularity” is actually a term that denotes the practice of using islanders for target practice. Mainlanders have been blowing each other apart for as long as anybody can remember, as well. Thus “insular” also probably has less to do with who lives on the mainland than it does with which mainlanders have more cannon and guns at a given time. In fact, simply being a mainlander has nothing whatsoever to do with anything. History is replete with situations in which so-called “islanders” happened to develop more cannon and guns (or some equivalent) faster than the mainland. Guess who was then attacked?
If you want a better definition for “insular,” this is what I think it should be:
• relating to or characteristic of any person or group with less power that strives to protect himself/itself from a person or group with more power
This definition simplifies things a bit. When we focus on what is characteristic of power and protection instead of upon what is characteristic of an island (and by extension isolation), we get at the heart of why insularity arises. We may also realize that at any given moment, anyone can have more power than we do. Thus all of us to an extent are insular. We have no choice but to be so.
You certainly exercise power in your own home, for example. You can invite into and expel from it anyone you wish (barring your own legal dependents, though at times you may wish you could expel them, too). You also expect protection from it. The fact that we can lock our front door is the sole reason many of us can sleep at night.
Now suppose you come home to find an uninvited stranger sitting in your favorite chair drinking your beer and watching a baseball game on your television set. You ask him to leave but he refuses, so you start to dial 911.
Imagine how absurd it would sound if he then accused you of being “insular.”
What’s confusing is that in a sense he’d be right. After all, you are closed to the idea of uninvited strangers being in your home, right? That whole concept is completely outside the scope of your outlook. And not only that; the more this particular stranger argues that he has a right to be in your home, the more likely it will become that you’ll make its interior inaccessible to his scrutiny. In fact the tiny group of people (think: island) permitted to enter your home without a formal invitation is probably limited to your immediate family and closest circle of friends, right?
Deaf people are insular because everyone on this planet is insular. When we’re guarding ourselves, our loved ones, our houses, or our culture, insularity is a necessity. Nothing in this world can survive without it, because whatever the outside world isn’t kept at bay from, it usually assimilates. That’s why we guard against it—or at least certain portions of it—in the first place. It’s why we don’t let our children stay overnight in the homes of people we don’t know. It’s why we have locks on our front doors, our car doors, our desks, and our safety deposit boxes. It’s why we have borders lined with chain link fences and armies to defend them.
So the next time Deaf people are accused of being insular, maybe we should take a moment to question just how much of the so-called “real world” we voluntarily isolate ourselves from. And if we’re arrogant enough to believe that we don’t, that we’re truly open to everything and everyone, maybe we should test this belief by propping open our front door and leaving it that way for six weeks straight. We are, after all, surrounded on all sides by people who are only too willing to take from us everything that we own. Give it enough time, and sooner or later one of them will show up.
Once that happens, a little bit of insularity will probably start looking pretty good.
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Optimistic and cheerful today about the hearing, aren’t we Chris? :P
Let’s look at it in another way. There is a difference between protecting yourself from complete, utter strangers who you have a hinky feeling about, and cautiously opening up a dialogue with people who are curious about us and our culture.
Because the truth is, we aren’t very welcoming to people who are curious about us. I am sure we all can share stories about a deaf person we know, rudely rebuffing a genuinely curious hearing person, because the deaf person has the mentality of, “Hey, a hearing person ticked me off, (doesn’t matter how recent or how long ago it was) so I’m gonna treat them how they treated me!”
Heck, we’re not even welcoming to each other sometimes, because we’re Deaf of Deaf, or Deaf of Hearing, or Hard of Hearing, or because we use ASL, PSE, SEE, Cochlear Implants.
No? We’re all very welcoming? Then why do we constantly debate the Crab theory, and scream it at someone who criticizes us, legitimately or not, be damned?
We also have a pretty bad cultural lag. We’re just discovering ideas, especially the concept of open-source, that the hearing already jumped on 5-10 years ago.
So yeah, I would say we’re insular. I think for us to move on as a culture, we have to take a look at everything within it, and that includes our bad aspects. Or else, we’ll never make progress.
Deaf Pundit,
I’m not sure what “open-source” has to do with the deaf community. Can you elaborate on that?
Sorry, I should’ve elaborated on that. I meant open-sourcing on ideas in general.
It’s only until very recently with the vlogs/blogs that we’ve begun open-sourcing our information.
But even then, we still quieten down when a hearie who doesn’t know sign comes along and makes a comment. We still don’t accept what they say, but accept it when a deaf person turns around and says the exact same thing.
But DP, for ever Deaf person out there who rejects hearing people (or “deaf” people, whatever), there’s a dark-skinned Black person who rejects both White people and lighter-skinned black people. There’s a “Womyn” who rejects men and all things “Man,” and all women who get along with men. There’s a gay person who… you see what I mean?
And we aren’t just insular from complete strangers. If you came home to find the Gas Meter Guy or the Termite Trap Guy or the Pizza Delivery Guy sitting in your favorite chair drinking your beer you’d be upset, no? But you’ve seen all of these people before!
I think it’s simply a question of boundaries. It’s just that boundaries can easily become walls, which isn’t good. But neither is having no boundaries whatsoever.
(Also, re: Shane’s comment, I too would like to see some expansion on “open source”..?)
That’s true, Chris, about boundaries but I don’t see a problem of us not having any boundaries when it comes to the hearing - not when it comes to deaf adults anyway. I do see a problem of low expectations for ourselves though, and that is different than having no boundaries.
I never said we were completely insular. That would be silly, and when I talk about being insular, I’m not talking in a literal sense when it comes to strangers.
But we are insular when it comes to ideas. We insist on re-inventing the wheel ourselves, because many of us think there’s no way in hell that a hearing person’s idea could be any good for us and be modified for our purposes. That’s where open-sourcing comes in. We take an idea, modify and build upon it and share it with others.
Deaf Pundit said: But we are insular when it comes to ideas. We insist on re-inventing the wheel ourselves, because many of us think there’s no way in hell that a hearing person’s idea could be any good for us and be modified for our purposes.
AMEN. And this is very self-destructive and imposes limits that would otherwise not be there.
I’d define insular, as related to the deaf community, as being disconnected from reality. More specifically, disconnected from how things work in the world. Perhaps willfully ignorant, perhaps not. Day in and day out I encounter such mind boggling interactions with deaf people in my job, and I have to scratch my head and wonder why their collective head is stuck in the sand. When I hear deaf people wonder why they get such shoddy treatment and disrespect from the hearing community, I have to chuckle because the answer is abundantly clear (at least in the business world): look in the mirror at how you, the deafie, treat the hearie (and deafies like me that you don’t know are deaf) and insist that special exceptions to the rules be made or else we are audists.
Perhaps people simply look for a reason to single out a culture they don’t understand, Deaf or not. For example, take the child who is bi-cultural (let’s say Mexican and Caucasian). Will that child identify with both cultures? Unlikely. The child will most likely identify more strongly with one culture. I know of a young lady who is both of these and identifies herself as Mexican. She has been known to say, “I hate white people, they…” Sometimes this is in a joking manner and sometimes not. As for the Deaf culture being insular, as you’ve said many people in today’s society are that way, but I think they notice it more about Deaf because people don’t truly understand how Deaf have been treated in the past and how things are today (CI’s “turning” Deaf into ‘hearing’ ideology). But this is just an observation.
Some people, including you, Chris, are conflating insularity with isolationism. One has nothing to do with the other.
I can understand it when people say that Deaf people are insular, with struggles over issues involving Deaf identity, Culture, ASL/SEE, etc., that are not part of the main culture’s concerns. I can also understand it when people say that Gallaudet itself is insular, with all its petty academic struggles and bickering.
When people say, “insular,” I think more along the lines of being part of a small town mentality. To me, that’s a blend of having fixed customs, thoughts, and practices, that are not part of a larger culture. An island within a larger continent is a very good description of Deaf Culture, I think.
But that can be said of any minority culture.
But you seem to have an inordinate fixation on power and the lack thereof, which appears common to a lot of academics. It’s a boring cliche, especially applied to minority cultures. Get over it and find a new trope to focus on for the Deaf.
Hello SIM:
“…that are not part of the main culture’s concerns.”
I agree with you that *Deaf* identity issues aren’t a part of the mainstream culture’s concerns (for the most part). But identity and culture and language are all things that mainstream cultures (and minority cultures) have been fighting wars over with each other for centuries. So I think that they DO concern themselves with these issues in general. And in that sense I think that English-speaking Americans who don’t want Los Angeles high schools in largely Latino neighborhoods to become bilingual are just as insular as Deaf people are supposed to be, given that we have a Spanish-speaking country just south of us that we’re going to have to learn how to deal with in this age of “globalization.” Not to mention a whole continent just south of them that utilizes Spanish, too.
“English-speaking Americans who don’t want Los Angeles high schools in largely Latino neighborhoods to become bilingual are just as insular as Deaf people are supposed to be…”
A continent, when you think about it, is just a large island.
The question then becomes how you deal with an apparent island that is growing bigger and bigger and may pose a threat to your way of life? Assimilate, expel, maintain the status quo, or something else altogether?
And, please, don’t use the trope about power because that’s a false dichotomy. There are very rare instances in the world when one is able to completely impose his will on another so that the first obliterates the second. It is much more likely that there will be exchanges, whether of the power variety, or cultural, or academic, or whatever. Everybody is exchanging something. You and I are exchanging information and perspectives, but we don’t have an upper hand on the other so no power questions involved.
But you’re right, in the long run, not everything is immune from challenges and convergences caused by different cultures.
I agree with all of that. As a matter of fact I was just thinking that same thing… in the age of globalization EVERYTHING is an island.
I think there will be exchanges, yes. And I think there will also be attempts to dominate and destroy, which will be met by resistance or submission.
But you’re right too… free exchange is a big, and hopefully growing part of it.
Okay, I’m the big bad hearie in this crowd for the moment I guess. So here’s what I think. First, insular means simply isolated. The island reference is to the fact the islands are isolated from the mainland. It doesn’t mean they purposely cut off anybody or anything like that. The same with insular as it is applied to Deaf folks. It means you keep to yourselves in a group of like people. It doesn’t attempt to ascertain why or how. And I agree it is a fact. Deaf people are insular, and so are many other groups. Nobody said it had to be a derogatory remark. Perhaps the person who said it, intended to be, but it isn’t that way by default. It strictly denotes some sort of separation.
I don’t think there’s anything wrong with being insular either, it helps maintain your culture and group identity. The problems start when you become isolationist. That’s a whole different thing. And some Deaf people ARE isolationists (some NOT ALL). They very much believe they and all Deaf people should keep as far away from all non-Deaf as possible, thereby reducing the problems they have to deal with. If you have ever read my posts you know I am against this, I believe you deal with problems or they just get worse.
My two hearie pennies on insular.
Dennis
You are correct about confusing insularity with isolationism. One does not mean the other.
Remember though that in the definitions I found for “insular,” insularity and isolationism DO seem to be interchanged quite a bit. Which is something I disagree with as well.
They share a common root, that’s all. That aspects of their definition seem to be in common doesn’t make them all mean the same thing or interchangeable (which doesn’t stop people from doing so ;-)
Someone who is isolated isn’t necessarily insular and vice versa. I’m isolated — I can count on my hands the number of deaf people I know/have met in real life (as opposed to on the internet). So, I am quite isolated. However (I hope) I’m not insular; I learn as much as I can from everyone I meet, whether online or face to face…
Dennis, I’m hearing too.
You’re not the big bad hearie, Dennis. Hopefully none of this comes across as anti-hearing. It’s not meant that way. I mean it all in the sense that people struggle to hold onto their identies and protect what they love in a world where everything around us is increasingly blurring and merging together.
I didn’t take it that way, I just like being melodramatic! :)
When is Adam Stone coming back? Anyone know? I’m tired of reading this drivel.
Y’know… I’ve always complained that many deafies seem to isolate themselves from the world around them. I’ve never used the words “insular” or “isolationism,” though.
At the risk of being flamed, I see this “isolationism” most within the Gallaudet community. Yes, Gallaudet is a “mecca.” It’s a place where people can go simply to “fall into” the World Of The Deaf — the World Where (almost) Everyone Signs. THE WORLD THAT IS DEAF.
But y’know what? That’s always bothered me, even since I was a kid. Yes, I was mainstreamed. Yes, I went to colleges other than Gally. So maybe there’s some bias here. But, the fact remains simple: the world around us IS hearing. And yet, I see so many friends, acquaintances, and others I don’t know well simply be content to congregate only with other deafies (and hearies who sign). There are those who say they would only date/marry another deaf person (or a CODA/interpreter). And then there are the news stories about deaf parents wanting deaf children.
I’ve often wondered if this whole issue of identity is being taken too far. Yes, I’m deaf, but I don’t use that as my first label — I’m Hilary–everything else is secondary. And I look around and I see people acting /saying “DEAF ME.” Not “ME DEAF.”
And I wonder.
Is it good for people who are deaf to insulate themselves within the deaf community only? Is it good to have the majority of life experiences be with only other deaf/signing peers, colleagues, family, and acquaintances?
I like my balance. I like having my hearing friends. I like my deaf friends. Sure, if I’ve gone for a long time without much interaction with other deaf people, then I’ll crave some “deaf time.” But I certainly don’t need, or want, that deaf time 24/7.
Hmmm.
I’ll be honest here: in real life, all of my friends are either deaf or hearing who sign. But that’s because I can’t speak or lipread well. On-line, I have several blog friends who are hearing and don’t know sign, which makes sense when you think about it. If we have to struggle to communicate with someone, we tend not to become friends, because it’s far too much effort.
But I do think it’s bad for us to not be open-minded about meeting those who are different than us. We’ve pretty insular when you consider the idea/cultural lag we have, and that’s happening for a variety of reasons but I think one reason is because our deaf leaders are encouraging us to be angry at hearing people indiscriminately.
Not all hearing people are bad. In fact, most of them don’t know what the system’s done to us. So why hurl our wrath at people who generally are clueless about what’s really going on? That’s the problem I have with Chris’ blog here.
Anger is a powerful motivator, definitely, but we have to learn how to use it in a positive way and learn the hearing’s rules of the game. Then we’ll beat them at their own rules.
I like the Socratic method for that. Socrates got arrested and was found guilty for inciting riots because he merely questioned people and trapped them in their own logic. The powers that be did not like that because it made people THINK about what was really going on.
“So why hurl our wrath at people who generally are clueless about what’s really going on? That’s the problem I have with Chris’ blog here.”
Where do you get that from? Where’s the “wrath?” I live my life pretty much the same as you live yours. Half of my friends are deaf, the other half hearing, but of the hearing half, most sign. If they don’t we usually write back and forth or we talk online.
Not any and all statements on why Deaf people might be resistant to hearing people are “anti-hearing” in and of themselves. I’m about to reply to Ricky Taylor next… I hope you’ll look at that.
Where do I get the impression from? From your blog entries, Chris.
You’re constantly writing about how hearing people have dominated us and how angry we should be about it.
DP, a question for you. When you wrote about that doctor in your blog (at least I’m pretty sure that was you), the one who violated your civil rights, how’d you feel about it?
Yeah, that was me. I was and still am ticked off about it. But I’m targeting my anger at the doctor and Michigan Dept. of Civil Rights. I’m not angry at ALL hearing people, because I think they could be very valuable allies in our fight for equality.
With my blog, I’m writing about it, but at the same time, I’m very mindful of the fact that words are powerful. Very powerful. I don’t want to stir up deaf people into emotional or physical violence, but I do try to encourage them to stand up for their rights in a logical and factual manner, and for the random hearing person who might stumble across my blog, to stop and think about what’s happening.
I’m also putting my talk into action, (and this isn’t directly at you, Chris) which seems to be somewhat lacking in the deaf community. It’s all grand to talk about what’s happening, but what’s the use of talking about it if people won’t stand up for their rights appropriately?
DP, when I kiss my hearing wife goodnight, I don’t say “Dream sweet, honey, I hate your guts.” And when I went to my hearing neighbors’ barbecue last Sunday, I didn’t tilt my Coke can at them and say “May you all burn in hell.” Okay? Whatever else you may believe, all of that is true. And so long as we’re talking about insularity, here, I honestly do think that *anger* is what keeps us insular. But it’s not just the anger we actually feel. Every time someone sends a strong message that we’re maybe not ready for, we use what we perceive as his “anger” (what, there’s NO possibility that he feels some other way?) as our excuse to not hear it.
Sooner or later that’s what some doctor is going to do to you, too… use what you think and feel against you. That way it’s no longer about what he actually did, it’s about YOU.
Maybe I’m wrong–who the hell am I, you know? But I really do think that if you ever wrote what you believe is an “appropriate” message that ALL deaf people can use to stand up for their rights, and posted that message on your blog, at least a few readers would accuse you of being angry at all hearing people. And such accusations would only increase each and every time your civil rights were violated.
Can you guarantee that wouldn’t happen?
Well, I would hope you don’t say that to your wife! :)
My civil rights’ been violated several times - as an adult that is. As a child, it was violated many, many times, and yeah, every single time they try to make it about me. People are like, ‘You’re angry!’ And my response is, ‘I’m angry because you violated my civil rights. But me being angry doesn’t violate your rights. I have the right to be angry. I’m not being rude or abusive to you. I am just asserting my rights.’
I don’t care if they’re angry. Ain’t my problem! If they think I’m inferior, and that doctor did - he told me I seemed rather intelligent - I’m not going to think I’m inferior because of him. I’m just going to think he’s an ass.
I guess I just don’t understand what you’re trying to accomplish with this kind of blog entries. To me, it doesn’t come across as encouraging us to assert our rights.
It comes across as you trying to be provocative and incite something. What exactly I don’t know. I would say that I’m not alone in thinking this, judging by others’ responses on here.
As for my blog: I don’t think readers of my blog would think I’m angry at ALL hearing people. I’ve had random hearing people who were googling for something and stumbled across my blog by that way, send me an email privately and the gist of their comments are, “Wow. Your blog made me think, and I’m discovering a totally new world! Keep it up!”
And what’s even more ironic is that thus far, I’m getting more support from the hearing on the Equal Communication Access campaign than I am getting from the deaf. I’m not sure what to make of that…
“It comes across as you trying to be provocative and incite something. What exactly I don’t know. I would say that I’m not alone in thinking this, judging by others’ responses on here.”
And I don’t know what to tell you except congratulations that your blog is generating the kinds of comments that you’ve been getting.
“Is it good for people who are deaf to insulate themselves within the deaf community only? Is it good to have the majority of life experiences be with only other deaf/signing peers, colleagues, family, and acquaintances?”
I would say no. I think that if you make that choice, you limit yourself and your life experiences. If you do not challenge yourself, you stagnate.
But then again, a lot of Deaf folks don’t have the capability of being able to communicate easily with hearing people so I can understand the frustration and the willingness to both lash out and build up walls against the outside world.
I disagree. It is a fallacy that hearing people are the ONLY ones who can “challenge” deaf people and make sure they don’t “stagnate.”
If you meet intelligent, well-educated Deaf people (and they do exist), a Deaf person will be challenged and will not stagnate.
A Deaf person does not need to be around hearing people in order to have “quality life”. You are a victim of “HEARING IS ALWAYS BETTER” thinking.
This has to do with quality/full communication access, and it is a fact that the hearing society is unable/unwilling to provide it. If you want to hang with them, fine. But don’t make the mistake of thinking that they will make your life challenging, exciting, etc etc etc. Hearing people are not the automatic answer to all the ills of Deaf people’s lives.
You misconstrue my comments; I said that the challenges a Deaf person has to face in today’s world is both external and internal. But the only way a Deaf person will succeed is by rising to the challenge and many of us do, with varying degrees of success.
“Hearing people are not the automatic answer to all the ills of Deaf people’s lives.”
I agree with that. But then again, a lot of Deaf folks compare and contrast ourselves to hearing folks. To them, we are “other” and to us, they are the “other” with all the good and ill that brings about.
Hilary, almost everyone’s insular. White people are isolated from other races. Americans are isolated from the rest of the world. Generally speaking.
The only way not to be insular (disregarding philosophical implications) is by constantly traveling and getting to know all kinds of people. Not many people do that, regardless of what color their skin is, their nationality or their hearing ability.
Exactly.
Agreed. It’s still quite possible that the deaf person choosing to interact with “only” signing friends still turns out to be much more well-rounded and happier than his/her counterpart who attempts to dot every single social “i” on the spectrum. For a long time, I thought that, if you were deaf, you *had* to make sure that some of your friends were hearing. But now I’ve come to realize that it makes absolutely no difference in how you choose friends, what really matters is how you treat everybody.
Chris: Some argued that the Gallaudet campus and many deaf schools are ingrained with insular which led us to have that feeling? I think, to an extent, it is. What about you?
r-
Hi Ridor:
I just think people are people, and we’re going to find a “range” of them no matter where we go and no matter what ideology we embrace. In that range we’ll find people who can cross over from one thing to another with relative ease, and some people who are so uncomfortable with (or terrified of) doing that, they won’t and never will. And I don’t think that only applies to minorities. That range exists within dominant majorities, as well. White males, for example, are one thing, and the KKK is another.
So as far as that goes, I think everyone is insular to some extent at least some of the time.
“I think everyone is insular to some extent at least some of the time.”
I’ll agree to that. Everyone can be an island at one time or another, it all depends on the emotional, physical, cultural, intellectual, and other tides, doesn’t it? Then again, Donne said no man is an island so the tides come and go but there are connections to the mainland….
Thank you Hilary. My thoughts exactly. I tried to say that above, but it fell on “deaf” ears (thus no comments on/acknowledgment of my point-whatever…) :-D
I’ve been preaching the mecca thing since I started posting a LONG time ago. “fell on deaf” ears… awww yeah.
*Giggles* Yep! I don’t even bother to read the deaf blogs as much anymore because they’re so self-absorbed and boring, touching on the same topics again and again and again. Or they slander (or allow their commenters to do so) and that’s a complete turn-off. Free speech comes with responsibility (ahem…RT…cough).
It’s ironic because I’m all for deaf rights and equality, but not at the politically/socially/logically unrealistic levels being promoted post-protest. Politically savvy minorities know how to pick their battles while building up political capital, and I’m afraid the Deaf community blew its share over JKF (and now KK and other people who made mistakes but did not deserve the wholesale “cleansing” the Deaf commentators are calling for - whether or not they realize it.) Just reading the blogs and the same retarded, closed minded, self-defeating lines spewed forth as “empowerment” is enough to make me seriously take another look at getting a CI and tell the Deaf community adios. Then I see interesting, thoughtful self-introspection like this blog, and I don’t quite give up hope. For that, Chris and the DeafDC gang, I am thankful.
“the same retarded, closed minded, self-defeating lines spewed forth as ‘empowerment’”….
Heh. Those are rather strong words, but I share your concerns about the deaf community being led by self-appointed leaders over a cliff like lemmings. And the apparent backlash against JKF supporters at Gallaudet is another cause for concern. That is going to make Gallaudet look bad in the eyes of Congress and the world.
But, seriously, that’s rather strong language. Heh. Better don your flame-proof suit and be glad you’re not posting under your real name.
Eh…ok, I agree those were strong choices for words. Sorry all. But you got my point, and that’s what matters. A lot of readers of DeafDC are in fact on the same page, or at least able to discuss differences intelligently and respectfully. I appreciate that.
No flame-proof suit required. I don’t give a damn what the folks around Gallaudet or the self-proclaimed leaders of the Deaf say about me. I’ve always stood strong on principles and common sense, and their gossip is hard to reconcile with proven character and my wish to see deaf truly empowered without tearing down the hearing community or ties to it in the process.
CS,
I agree with you about deaf blogs in general. That’s why I rarely peruse deafread.
However, echoing my earlier comment here, there’s a lot of self absorbed blogs out there. Millions of the read-about-what-time-I-took-my-medication, what-kind-of-bagel-I-ate-for-breakfast drivel beneath those great special interest blogs. Unlike some ridiculous deaf blogs, they don’t go to aggregrated blog sites.
I’m an “ASL-using, culturally Deaf person” who has heard the crap from many hearing people and their supporters (i.e., oralists, etc) that we are insular or isolated for practically my entire life.
Chris, I think you are being a tad literal when you tried to analyze “insular” (or “isolated”).
Since I’ve heard this crap my entire life, what usually happens is this:
I go around talking with my Deaf friends in ASL.
Boom, a hearing person or a culturally blind deaf person throws this insult: ‘You guys are insular/isolated and should join the real world!’
In essence, we ASL-using, culturally Deaf people are being told that to use ASL all the time and to spend bulk of our time with other signing Deaf people is a bad thing.
We’re supposed to ignore our basic need for full communication access and just grit our teeth and ‘join the real world.’
Ironically…the minute a signing, culturally Deaf person enters a nonsigning environment, s/he is TRULY isolated. TRULY insular.
But nooooooo….hearing people and their supporters don’t give a **** about that. Screw communication access. Screw quality communication. What’s so important to them: we Deaf people just have to be THERE, even if we don’t understand a damn thing anybody’s saying.
And that’s why the next time anybody tells me I’m “insular” and “isolated”, I tell them: Not in my world, I’m not. I’m insular and isolated in YOUR world. Provide me with full communication access and I’m there. Otherwise, forget it.
-Michele Ketcham
well? What’s wrong with trying to join the rest of the world? People don’t understand and treat you the way you are describing because similar individuals like YOU refuse to meet them half way.
That’s the whole problem with the world, racism, religious sects, medical malady differences, money, social status… it goes on. This is what people like to do, people LOOOOOOOVE —— DEEE-RAMA! People LOVE to fight, people LOVE to make others upset. well, you know, maybe not Virginia Beach but hey…. at least she’s trying. =)
Anyway, the point, Chris is weak in thought, you’ll have to forgive him, he just likes to talk, dwelling on “insular” and it’s meaning and how he feels rejected by the rest of the world. (sigh) whatever. It’s not so bad to try and work with the rest of the world. =) People don’t understand deaf culture and all they know of it is what they read in the media. So why can’t we educate them? Oh wait, that’s right…. a bunch feel that they are too good for that. =)
so instead of strapping on your combat boots and screaming for social justice, why dont’ you put on your thinking cap and say to yourself “hmmmmm how do I alleviate this this problem?” instead of taking the action: “oh I know! how about I cry about it on the internet!!” you could try and drop the shields and say “hey you know, of course it’s more comfortable to travel with birds of the same feather, if you get what I mean, but if you have any questions you are more than welcome to ask.”
okay that’s put aside….
with the internet rolling in full force and everyday people are joining the world of the intraweb. Pretty soon, everything will be done via video and work will be done from home through all internet means. EVERYTHING will have a caption to it in all forms of language. Dates will be made on the internet, friendships will be discovered through the internet, it’s already happening now, but the internet will control our lives in the future. All this bickering about “insular” “secularization” ” us vs them” “me vs the world” god… grow up already.
Hmmm. One thing I should point out. I got on the Internet back in 1987 (that is not a typo). Back then EVERYTHING was text. It was great!
If anything, over time, I’ve seen more and more English (or Spanish) materials become less and less accessible. Video clips and podcasts are increasingly popular, and rarely captioned or transcribed.
So forgive me if I don’t quite share this same rosy “oh it will all be captioned” burble that you have. Yeah, and “all tv will be captioned by January 2006.” Yup, and I have a bridge somewhere around here to sell ya; you want it?
Michele,
But by the very resistance to join once in a while the hearing world you are supporting the notion of being isolationist (I’m not going to use the term insular here). Granted, any hearing person who tell you that the deaf community is insular/isolationist and go as far as to encourage you to join the “real world” would be in the wrong. But if that person made an effort to say that in sign language or even wrote it down, that that person has made an implicit effort to try breach the communication barriers and join your world. I would hope those words wouldn’t be their first.
A lot of people here have compared deaf culture’s “isolationist” nature to that of many other minorities or cultures but they also have ignored that there were efforts to breach those cultural differences. You don’t have to stop talking in sign language, lose your deaf friends and that you have abandoned your identity the moment you make an effort to talk with hearing people. Granted, the conversation may not be as engaging or enlightening as with your ASL-deaf friends. Any communication barrier would naturally stymie that stimulating conversation, it is only with time that it gets better but perhaps never the same and that is acceptable.
By refusing to acknowledge that there is a case to make such an effort, you are in effect supporting being insular and isolated. You are also supporting their (in this case, the non-ASL hearing crowd) insular and isolated world.
By the way, I understand that anger in response to that person who would dare to say deaf culture is insular without making any efforts to try sign language. In that case, irritation or anger would be justified. But no harm in encouraging that person to learn some sign language and to try talk to that person in return.
DC Boots:
I am not “resisting” joining the hearing world.
I am not angry.
What I am resisting is being made or forced to accept substandard access and limited/poor communication just to make hearing people happy.
I have made a conscious choice to demand quality access in communication and not accept crumbs.
Yes, by all means encourage hearing people learn sign language. I’m certainly not against that.
Take a close look at Dead Tired’s experience in the hearing company she works for…this is a perfect example of what I am talking about: her boss and co-workers just want her THERE, but they don’t make any effort to include her or to make sure she has information that they are getting, even though she has been asking for that information.
I see that played out in the hearing society, over and over again, and I can guarantee that when Dead Tired talks to her boss about it yet again, they will just say “Oh yes, we will be sure to include you the next time” and then when the next time does come, she will be left out yet again.
Dead Tired is INSULAR and ISOLATED in her hearing company.
Yet, in the eyes of hearing society, Dead Tired’s insularity and isolation in her hearing company is somehow “better” and more acceptable than the so-called insularity and isolation in Deaf world.
(Side note to Punky: I don’t consider Chris Heuer “weak-minded” at all, and I have a lot of respect for him. Shame on you for saying so.)
Michele,
I appreciate your response. I understood the reasoning, but you missed the point of my response. My point is that if there are natural communication barriers (as often the case with a ASL-deaf person and an oral hearing person) then the quality of the conversation may not be up to your ideal standards and it is only with time that this improves, perhaps not to the same standard you would have with your ASL friends but it does improve nonetheless.
And I argued that by refusing to acknowledge this and demanding immediate and 100 percent quality talk, you are in effect supporting being insular or isolated for all cultures/communities/individuals concerned.
Hearing people also have to accept the the same “substandard access and limited poor communication” in order to communicate with us. I doubt that their concept of 100 percent quality conversation includes notewriting or medicore sign language, yet we encourage, or even demand that they do this in order to communicate with us.
And that is good in my opinion (each to their own). That is acceptable, because not every culture or community share a language or same communication tools. There are differences even between British’ English and American English. There will be clashes, and even poorer level of communication between French and Americans who don’t know each others language well. But that should not discourage effort on either side to communicate and it would be unrealistic to demand 100 percent quality in such a scenario. It is only with time, on an individual basis that it does improve.
As for Dead Tired, since I do not know her personally and know the background I must respectfully decline to make her the topic or to use her as an example. Without intimate knowledge of her situation, I cannot predict the outcome of any course of action she pursues. However, I will say this - I too work in a hearing company and I have encountered similar difficulties (though not as difficult as hers) but I also have experienced close friendships derived from workplace and have had that carry over. I have learned, quite frankly, that it was more to do with personality and finding common interests outside of the workplace.
And let us be honest, there exist too in the deaf workplace exclusion of other deaf people on the basis that well, they don’t share common interests. This is not a cultural phenomenon limited to deaf people in hearing workplaces. Granted, the communication barrier makes it difficult to have a quality conversation but it is not insurmountable and should not be resisted on the basis that you won’t be able to debate the virtues of Karl Marx verses Jefferson in the very first conversation.
Still reading through the comments but I would disagree that power/insularity are interwined in the way that you said. In particular, I think one of the biggest problems ANY minority group faces is the INSULARITY of the majority, who refuse to open their minds to other or additional possibilities. Many people in the majority are insular because they have no reason to examine their opinions and worldview, and they have the power to deflect challenges to those views and opinions.
personally, I think the BIGGEST separation between anyone is money and power. It’s all about elitism, money talks and bullsh1t walks, it’s always been that way. It’s sad really, but everyone wants to be a part of something and feel accepted. Thus insularity.
Yeah, Paris Hilton is too insular to stay in jail and learn a little about real life ;-)
That’s a very good point, BEG. Never thought about it that way.
“culturally blind deaf person”??? What the heck is that? Blind people do not have a “culture” and the argument that just because you share a disability, you share a culture is baloney (not that that argument was made here…I’m just sayin’.)
This is why I have such a hard time with culture being attached to the deaf community. Suppose I learn Chinese and speak, write, and read it fluently. Does that make me cuturally Chinese? With deaf people, you have folks from all different sorts of races, backgrounds, religions, economic privilege, and educational levels. Losing one’s hearing and learning to communicate in ASL automatically makes one culturally deaf? Or just deaf? If I, as a white person, went among black people and lived for 50 years, would I become cuturally black, even after learning to speak the dialect? NO. So how can deaf people say that knowing and using ASL is a distinct cultural trait? Am I missing something? What is this so-called culture in the deaf community and why is it tied only to a language anyone can learn/use??
Ok waaaayy off topic.
I agree about the captioning being a pipe dream. There is no economic incentive for people to use manpower/time/money to caption video material. It’s done now because A) the law requires some instances or B) the producer has a big heart/deep pockets.
Such as…? I’d love to read substantive stuff, not the musings I see on deafread.
didn’t they say the same kind of thing about closed captioning decoders to be standardized in all tv’s? hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm OH wait! they even said we’d never have video phones!
(slaps head) OH MAN i got ran over by an EMU!
Not to make light of this post or the issuing discussion, but will someone please explain why, after reading all these comments, I have a sudden urge to go read John Donne again?
Donne said, No man is an island. ;->