It’s been a year since we first read about the NAD’s complaint against the Redskins. In a nutshell, complainants wanted access to announcements and rulings and that sort of thing during games.
This morning, the Washington Post printed an update on the complaint.
I’m fuzzy on what the update itself is, but basically the NAD says the Redskins franchise hasn’t done enough. The Redskins say they don’t know what more they can do, and no way in heck are these announcements going up on the JumboTron.
Read into the situation what you will. I’m not familiar enough with the case to know what technological remedies have been accepted or rejected, and so as a Redskins fan I just have to sit, let the lawyers battle it out, and hope someday I’ll have the same game experience as everyone else. But one thing I glean from the WaPo piece is that the Redskins would like to believe that asking for equal access for all paying fans, deaf or not, is woefully unjust.
David Donovan, attorney for the team, said in an interview last week that the team had gone above and beyond to accommodate deaf and hearing-impaired fans.
“At this point, we are scratching our heads,” Donovan said. “As far as we are concerned, we have done everything that we have been asked to do. There is no other stadium in the NFL or professional sports that has attempted to accommodate the hearing impaired as much as we do.”
The thing is, if they can accommodate hearing fans by maintaining a sound system and hiring the personnel to run it and send out these announcements, then why is making sure the same information is available visually going “above and beyond” for the “hearing impaired?” Why isn’t it instead a scenario of making sure all fans get what they paid for - a good ol’ game of gridiron and all the trappings that come with it?
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I read this “Update” on the Metro this morning and was saddened to read that in spite of their attempts to reconcile the dissatisfaction, the “hearing-impaired” fans continued to ask for more.
My perspective is that, if someone or an organization initiates some form of access or support, I would welcome it with open arms. No, it wouldn’t be perfect, but it would be a stepping stone. I truly believe in the ripple effect. If the Redskins/FedEx were able to go through with their captioning proposal from the Colorado firm (despite the “10-minute delay”), then other stadiums would follow suit and possibly adopt better technology. Rather than other stadiums saying, “Look, the Redskins haven’t been able to do it, so why should we even attempt?”
In general, if someone even tries to meet me in the middle, I’m game. (No pun intended) I would be much more accepting of a babystep than nothing at all.
The ten-minute delay is ridiculous. I wouldn’t accept that at all ON my television programming, much less a live football event. Why should we have to accept a ten minute delay in live captioning?
There are operas here in Washington, D.C., that have live captioning, and as a result, I’ve been able to enjoy the opera with my hearing peers. If the operas here can do it, then why NOT a football stadium?
I know, the 10-minute delay is ridiculous. I do wonder if that can be fixed if this firm’s technology were to be used. I thought that if they were to adopt this system, then the technological “tweaks” could take place, making it more accurate.
You misunderstand. There is no delay with what the Redskins have been doing since early last season. It is almost instantaneous. The stenographer at FedEx does real-time captioning that comes up on two boards on the 50 yard lines as fast as he can transcribe what the PA announcer says. The 10 minute delay referred to the Colorado company, whose product was rejected.
Yes, that is the argument I was trying to make. Thanks for making it more clear. What is the issue, afterall? The stenographer seems to do the job. What I got from the “Update” is that people were still at odds over this issue. I would be perfectly content with a stenographer’s work as long as it told me what was going on!
I haven’t been to a game in over a year, so this was news to me. Now, like Cookies, I’m interested in why the WaPo says the complainants aren’t satisfied… or why the complainants say that.
This is news to me too. If the system is already in place, then why are the complainants still, well, complaining?
I went to a Mets game at Shea Stadium last week and they kept playing video clips on the big screen but they were never captioned …. until at one point a clip of Mets players talking about something was captioned IN SPANISH! So they obviously have the technical capability to add captioning to the big screen, but they don’t care about us deaf folks. Funny thing is, there’s no law that says they have to add Spanish captioning and yet they are quite obviously in violation of the Americans with Disabilities Act. My ticket cost as much as the hearing folks paid, but they had full access to all the information, and I didn’t.
Also, I find it outrageous that the Mets games on Sportsnet New York are not closed-captioned. What century is this? I wrote to my cable provider last year to complain and was told SNY is a new station and they have three years to start captioning. What’s the point in waiting until the last minute? I bet they could caption the games all year long with what they pay Tom Glavine to pitch one game. And ironically, the Mets are having a special Deaf Day on Sept. 29. How hypocritical can you get?
To Tom Willard…
I agree with you about the Mets games at Shea. It’s very frustrating for this die hard Mets fan. Even, SNY, too. I’ve emailed SNY to complain but I’m surprised that they told you it would take three years to do that. They didn’t say that to me but they said they would consider on putting that in near future. But I won’t give up because I would keep bothering them as well as other deaf Mets fans. Yes, other deaf Mets fans still are emailing SNY to nag them, LOL.
You got that right about Deaf Awareness at Shea Stadium on 29th which I’ll be attending. It’s not right and very hypocrite.
Die hard Mets fan,
Misha
I didn’t actually contact SNY, I contacted my local cable provider as I was going by the FCC captioning rules. It was Time Warner that told me that SNY has up to three years from its birth date to start captioning.
Here’s what it says on SNY’s website under FAQs …
Q: Is closed captioning available on SportsNet New York?
A: We are always looking to add features to help make our telecasts more enjoyable for all of our viewers. However, when starting a new network - adding all of these different elements take time. Closed captioning is important to SNY, and we currently are looking into adding this feature to our channel. In the interim, we ask that you remain patient as we work toward adding closed captioning to our network.
Here’s their email address if anyone wants to contact them: sportsnetnewyork@sny.tv
My hunch is that the plaintiffs and NAD really want captioning on the jumbotron. Captioning the televisions near the concession stands inside the stadium is all well and good. But let’s face it, when you buy the (very expensive) tickets, you want to see the action in person and get the information at your seat. That means captioning the jumbotron.
The only other alternative I can think of is some PDA the Redskins can give out to deaf fans containing captioning of what’s being said…
I hope Shane will be gracious enough to add his thoughts/comments to this thread.
Captioning is not just on the TVs by the concession stands. It is on both sides of the field on the 50 yrd line in great big letters on big displays. Anybody in the stadium can see them, from their seats.
Shane prolly can’t because he’s involved with the class action lawsuits, and any plaintiffs pretty much can’t comment during pending lawsuits, to my knowledge.
I went directly to the source: NAD website. I found the original complaint: http://www.nad.org/site/pp.asp.....;b=2048621
Basically, the complaint says: “…asks the court to order the Washington Redskins and FedEx Field to provide and display captioning on the scoreboards and video monitors for all announcements made over the public address system, including plays and penalties called, safety and emergency information, and any other announcements.”
Their complaint is reasonable…after all, the ADA *does* require public places to provide captioning on their TV monitors, screens, etc.
And we all know that the technology for captioning is already here, and there’s really no excuse for Redskins (or Mets or any other teams) to continue to avoid providing captions for people who come to the games.
I am just wondering here - if the video monitors and the jumbotron are in high def, isn’t that why captions won’t work with them? (There have been earlier blogs discussing the problems with HDTVs and captions)I was just reading the other day that Verizon Center is going HD, and also wonder if that will prevent captioning during events there?
For whatever it’s worth, this concern about accessibility at FedEx Field is mirrored at the University of Michigan football stadium. Over the past year or so, intermittent press items, such as this article of February 23rd in the Michigan Daily, have reported on how disabled vets want a proposed renovation of Michigan Stadium to comply with ADA accessibility regulations.
Apparently the disabled vets now have a limited selection of seating options that are not especially attractive.
The university administrators, on what seems to be a technicality, are claiming that the proposed construction work on Michigan Stadium would not require fresh accommodations for the disabled.
You can guess what the disabled vets think about that claim.
The latest news is the athletic department and the veterans are still negotiating, however a trail seems likely.
Interesting piece of information is some people feel the veterans are being used by the opponents of the project to stop the project. Hmmmm… I didn’t think of this approach.
That interpretation of the situation is news to me.
If the veterans are indeed being “used” by opponents of the Michigan Stadium renovation, one might suspect that the veterans would welcome being used. I think that many legal and political agendas intersect in such a way so as to afford benefits to parties whose objectives do not neatly overlap. In this case, the veterans get a platform for their concerns.
Until I see evidence of veterans getting legal and financial assistance from other opponents of the stadium’s renovation, it would be hard for me to accept the notion that the veterans are being exploited. WAD, has the press reported on any third parties stoking the flames of the veterans’ ire against the University of Michigan?
The opponents are the alumni and others who do not want to change at the stadium. They have been **VERY** active. It has nothing to do with the veterans being financed from the outside.
Most of the disagreement is over the interpretation, and not the principal. There are a lot of energy that is going on in the fight is on the interpretation while the disabled access never has been a concern. It’s the reason why some people questioned the motivation of the fight.
If you check the website, you will see that University of Michigan is committed to ADA compliance and strongly believe the plans are in compliance. http://www.umich.edu/stadium/
What I’ve consistently found interesting is that blogs that focus on Gallaudet, “deaf” realpolitik, detailed analysis on whether a particular type of upbringing of a deaf child is proper, why oralism is bad and should be disowned, or whether an reviewier acted properly by providing a substantive analysis of a deaf author’s novel will generate a lot of heated passion, fuss, along with lines being drawn between several camps.
In other words, there’s posting, posturing, and discussions which are at its essence about navel gazing on what it means to be deaf.
But whenever there’s a blog that showcases advocacy at its finest such as Shane Feldman and other plaintiffs suing for total access of captioning at football stadiums or movie theatres, a blog discussing why more deaf people aren’t interested in focusing on getting more involved politics so the community can become a more of an effective lobby on the federal and state level, or other substantive discussions about whether one shouldn’t gently let go of our deafness as a crutch, very little discussion is generated.
It is almost as if the most of the people in the community couldn’t be bothered. Why is it? In my darkest moments, I sometimes suspect it’s because those issues aren’t capable of short-term fixes and often require a complete attitude adjustment.
In the meantime, discussions about the world’s greatest irony, protesting at a recent AG Bell convention, or making snide comments about a person’s Cued Speech background is not going to do you much good the next time you go to a stadium and wish you had total access to what is going on, go to an interview and wish that you had an competent sign language interpreter because the better ones are currently working at a video relay service (VRS) center, or have a nagging suspicion that whenever the politicians talk about millions and millions of Americans with disabilities, they’re not actually not talking about deaf people but rather those who have formed into a strong lobbying organization e.g. blind people, those with diabetes, or those with leaning disabilities.
Food for thought. So the next time one struts around beating his chest, I’d like to think of a even bigger irony which is that the more we beat our chest about audism, peer in our navel about what it means to be deaf, or hiss “crab theory” whenever someone is criticized, the rest of the world just simply continues to pass us by without paying attention.
This pretty much echoes my thinking about navel-gazing posts.
However, if you look at deafread.com, you’ll see several posts about Equal Communication Access, but it’s a vlog contest about equal communication access, so I wonder what they’re planning to do with the winning video. Will they market it? Where is the focus on that beyond the contest? I’ve noticed that they had problems with getting enough numbers of the vlog entries in.
DeafDC.com, sad to say, has been the leading blog about communication issues and disability accomodations. These issues really haven’t expanded far into the blogs on deafread.com.
Noelle, ECA is a blog/vlog contest, really. The community just wanted ASL translations for the blog entries.
ECA doesn’t have the money to market the winning b/vlogs, or even for anything. Not until people start donating serious money. Right now, my plan is to just put it up on the website I’m working on right now, and see what happens from there.
I’m hoping the ECA website will be a jumping off point to bigger things, but that will require more volunteers and money.
Scott,
Your comment about strong lobbying organizations made me realize something — blind people, people who are diabetic, who have learning disabilities, mental health issues, etc., have one thing in common:
Most of them didn’t grow up in the deaf ed system.
One thing I’ve noticed is the sad reality that there are so few deaf adults who are truly educated… doesn’t matter whether it was in the mainstream (like you and me) or in schools for the deaf. Our parents, our teachers, our supporters/advocates, if you will, made sure that we knew how to “speak up” for ourselves and to go after what we want because we could, and can, do anything we set our minds to.
I have to wonder about all the others — what did they learn growing up? Did they learn the importance of self-advocation, not just because they’re deaf, but in general? Did they learn how to approach others and lobby, reason, negotiate, and compromise? Or did they learn that they didn’t have to learn high school algebra and other mathematics because they’d never earn more than a blue-collar living or could use VR and SSI when they were adults and not have to be taxpaying citizens?
Hmm….food for thought, eh?
Thanks for the navel-gazing blog, Scott.
(And enjoy the third year!)
Hilary, I found your comment to have a condescending tone toward people not educated in the same system you and I grew up in. FWIW, there were plenty of students in OUR system that faced the same fate of lack of advocacy models. We’re not all that great ourselves, and I don’t think we deserve to opine from such a pedestal.
If you’d like to clarify the pity you feel for the masses of deaf people that aren’t “truly educated,” please feel free. I don’t know about others, but I’d benefit from such a clarification.
I didn’t intend for my comment to come off as pitying. Also, I never said anything about our system, nor that we were all success stories. I said it didn’t matter whether students are in the mainstream or in schools for the deaf. My point — and maybe I didn’t make it clear enough — was that I wondered how many deaf students were taught how to advocate for themselves. I know I was encouraged to advocate for myself — I had plenty of encouragement from the people around me. It wasn’t just my parents, it was also others involved in my own education–teachers, transliterators, counselors, etc.
I would never say that one educational approach or system fits all, Alli. I hope you know me better than that.
Education isn’t just about academics. It also covers incidental learning. It’s not as though we take a class on self-advocacy and negotiation. Time and time again, I see comments regarding communications, interactions with others, and I’ve realized that we all have to “negotiate” every day, but we may not always do it effectively. Furthermore, what works for me may not work for you and vice versa. But that’s part of the learning process (and part of growing up!), but I do think that when a group of people want to advocate for a larger group (like with this captioning lawsuit against the ‘Skins) and people question the motivation and the desire, or else comment that we have no clout because we’re deaf — then that leads me to wonder just how many of us are really schooled in self-advocacy and negotiation and understanding the importance of reaching for the stars as opposed to just laying on the couch every day, content to live off government handouts?
No pity here, my friend… it’s just frank curiosity, plain and simple.
To self-advocate or to advocate for other Deaf people, one must first have a good self-esteem.
And that is what many deaf people don’t have.
Additionally, one must have good grasp of community structure around you, and that requires a certain amount of education and the ability to think logically.
If you possess weak reading/writing skills, then it’s rather difficult to think logically.
And in case anyone’s wondering…I grew up in schools for the Deaf, and I am bilingual. I am not oral and I did not grow up in mainstreaming programs.
Scott-
You raised some good questions.
A different way to look at this issue- maybe it’s because blogs that advocate equal access are less controversial, less likely to generate heated debates between the extremes of deaf people? Blogs that almost everyone can agree on get less comments, that’s a given.
Non-ASL deaf (for the lack of a better term) people make up a sizable proportion of “navel gazing” blogs’ commenters. Nothing wrong with that- those types of blogs simply are more debatable.
While Ben M’s comment is a good, solid caveat, I loved reading yours, Scott.
I suspect the same is true for the general population; it’s easier to go on an introspective journey than become a sweaty activist. Your comment brought that contrast out quite nicely.
GO TO DENVER THEY CC THE FOOTBALL GAMES… MAYBE THAT LAWYER SHOULD GET OUT OF THE COURT ROOM A LITTLE MORE AND SEE WHAT IS HAPPENING IN OTHER PLACES….
Wrong, DC. The Broncos do not provide captioning on videoboards/jumbotron. They provide pagers to those who ask, which involve a slight time delay. The Redskins provide captioning on videoboards on the 50 yard lines, visible from virtually all seats in the stadium, as fast as the stenographer can transcribe it. The Houston Texans also provide in-stadium captioning, like the Redskins; the Broncos do not.
SCOTT YOU HIT RIGHT ON THE NAIL HEAD….
THE FACT THAT THESE PEOPLE ARE THE LOWEST OF THE LOWLY EDUCATED THAT WILL LEAVE GALLY AND END UP ON SSI AND CONTINUE TO BE A BURDEN ON US ALL.. TOO BAD THEY DONT SEE THE SOLUTION TO THE PROBLEM BY GETTING AN EDUCATION AND GIVING BACK TO THE COMMUNITY… WHY WORK HARD WHEN THEY CAN SIMPLY JUST SCREAM HOLLAR AND HOOT AND EVERYONE WILL LOOK AND FEEL SORRY FOR THEM… THUS GIVING THEM A FREE RIDE IN LIFE.
THESE PEOPLE WILL NEVER BE ABLE TO AFFORD TO ATTEND A REDSKIN’S GAME SO WHY SHOULD THEY CARE ABOTU SHANES FIGHT??? THESE PEOPLE WILL NEVER KNOW WHAT IT IS LIKE TO EARN A REAL LIVING AND BE FREE TO DO AS YOU CHOOSE… THE ONLY LIFE THEY WILL EVER KNOW IS GETTING DRUNK ALL THE TIME… MAKING UP STORIES AND LYING ABOUT THINGS… PULLING OTHER SUCCESSFUL PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL SO NO ONE HAS MORE THEN THEY HAVE… DO NOT FOR GET THEIR NEED TO HAVE ILLEGAL DRUGS… THEY LIKE TO SCREAM HOW EVERYTHING IS UNFAIR TO THEM…
SOUNDS LIKE THESE PEOPLE GOT A PLAN TO MAKE EVERYONES LIVES SUCK AS MUCH AS THEIRS… THATS THE EASIER THING TO DO THEN WORK HARD.
LONG LIVE THE DEAF COMMUNITY
Hey DC, you might want to collaborate with Tom Bertling on a book. You both think alike.
When I went back to DeafDc.com after making my initial post, I cringed somewhat when I re-read my statements. First, I would like to apologize for coming off sounding very strident and perhaps, much worse, being embarrassed about being profoundly deaf or being embarrassed about the deaf community.
Second, I’d like to expand on Noelle’s comment about how DeafDC.com … has been the leading blog about communication issues and disability accommodations…”. I previously stated that it frustrated me at how many commentators did not seem to be particularly interested in exploring what links us all and ironically, what links us all is not our deafness because we cannot even agree on what it means to be deaf. We cannot agree on what sort of educational system and techniques / communication modes should be in place for the deaf, and we tend to take offense so easily. But what links us all? The answer seems to be the fact that many of us are professionals and we enjoy hearing how we all have figured out how to give back to society.
As a result, I’d like to propose that DeafDC.com consider making use of its “Deaf Professional” tagline where it can select one month (e.g. December) and then arrange for a new blog everyday written by different deaf professionals. Note: This isn’t a novel idea – I am actually stealing this idea from an old book that I used to have which I think was called “Great Deaf Americans”. Does anyone recall this book? The one I used to have was in yellow and on each page, it had an black and white illustration of each deaf individual with a biography. That book had a significant impact on me because I was able to see how varying people, with different levels of deafness, schools of thought, and mental attitudes tried to show that it was the ability that mattered, not the “dis”ability.
But here: the focus wouldn’t be on “Great Deaf Americans” but rather on “Deaf Professionals”. What I think would be exciting is to see a blog each day from a huge diverse group of deaf professionals such as students from high school, Ph.D programs, law schools, MBA programs, etc that talk about how they have adjusted to the academic demands, those working in the government or the private sector, those who have started their own business, and so forth. The group of people would be a cross-mixture of oral people, Cued Language (Speech), American Sign Language, or any others that have adopted a mixture of communications. The theme would be focused on how they have learned to think outside the box, how to demonstrate that their deafness gives them an advantage, and how to “sell” themselves to their employers and to the rest of the world.
Finally, the target audience would be really for the parents of hearing children and those who are deaf that are interested in learning more about whether there are others just like them. To give you an example, I think a parent of a deaf child would enjoy reading about a good friend of mine who has completed law school at UCLA and just recently took the law bar. Doubtless, she has many tidbits and strategies about how she learned to leverage sign language interpreters in a legal environment. I also know of another person who started out at National Technical Institute for the Deaf (NTID) in the associate degree program but his passion for programming lead him to Rochester Institute of Technology (R.I.T). Because of his skills, and not because he is deaf, Microsoft eagerly recruited him. His story, I suspect, would make a great inspiration for many parents.
Am I making sense? I hope so. I realize this would be a massive undertaking by DeafDC.com but I think this could be one of those projects that have huge ripple effects.
I think it’s a great idea and deserves a further discussion on this.
Ditto
FYI, “Great Deaf Americans” has since been updated and expanded, and published by Matthew S. Moore, with the title “Great Deaf Americans, 2nd Edition”. It’s even better than the first edition.
I think that idea will be a better direction than reading some of self-promotional garbage we come across. Also, DeafDC.com need to become even more diversified in representation of its bloggers. Far beyond what I notice-a pattern of numerous Montgomery County Public Schools (Md.) alumnus (and former students) and one or two from mostly agricultural Frederick County. I’m not biased. I’m an alumnus of the mainstreaming system in one of the two aforementioned counties. We need to tackle real issues. DeafProfessional.net is better charged with that task but has questions relating to full-time staffing as is commonplace considering the D/deaf economy. Seriously, DeafDC.com needs a massive overhaul. I’ve had enough with mostly silly displays pseudo-intellectualism. At least Chris Kaftan didn’t place his recent entry at i711.com here on DeafDC.com. :::shudders:::
Blog Central shows at least five alumnus or former students from Montgomery County Public Schools (Md.) and one alumnus or former student from Frederick County Public Schools (Md.). That doesn’t even include several guest bloggers!
Hmm… just went to the blog central. I see only three current active bloggers from MoCo public schools.
That’s three out of 19. A mere 15%. And considering this is DeafDC, I’m pretty impressed that we have plenty of bloggers who didn’t grow up here.
And then, oh yeah…there’s the fact that MoCo and Fairfax County have two large mainstream programs for deaf students, not to mention the existence of MSD-Frederick and Columbia (before Columbia became a day institute for deaf people with multiple disabilities), Kendall, MSSD, and River School (private school that takes deaf oral students). What other area has so many options for deaf education?
This isn’t DeafNation, DeafSpook. This is DeafDC. Emphasis on the DC. And regular and guest bloggers have been invited from all over the U.S.
DeafSpook, if you have such a problem with DeafDC, why don’t you start your own community blog? It’s one thing to bark and yap. It’s another to actually do something.
Respect is a two-way street.
If you say this isn’t DeafNation, what are you implying about DeafNation, Eh?
What’s your idea of a large mainstreaming program? Especially on the high school level. I can name many far more larger than few here and there. University (Irvine, Calif.) and Whitney Young (Chicago, Ill.) have about 150 students in high school alone. Even at times larger than the pitiful enrollments posted by Maryland and Model (125-225). Who cares about your percentages. These inactive bloggers are still enlisted as assets by DeafDC.com. You should research for correct facts on Columbia. You need to travel and read more and realize there’s many like here. Especially in California, Illinois, Texas and New York to name a few. The media and county-wide academic promotions creates false perceptions about numbers. Admittedly, I was tempted to think that “Wow, we have many” but when I traveled, lived the real-world out there, I’m glad I didn’t enter the school of naive thinking.
University High School is in a pretty large district and just far enough from Riverside to prevent ease in daily commuting to CSDR. I’m not familiar with Whitney Young, so I can’t comment on that. Murrow HS in Brooklyn used to have as many as 75-100 students at a time. The same with the program school in Manhattan — can’t remember the name at the moment. The numbers have dwindled — many more students are now going to non-deaf-program-based schools.
As for this area, Rockville HS and Eleanor Roosevelt HS are about 45 minutes apart. RHS and Woodson HS are between 30-45 minutes apart (depending on your lead foot and the Beltway traffic). Put the three schools together, and you get that 75-100 student number. And keep in mind they’re competing with not one, but two schools for the deaf close-by, at both the elementary and secondary level (MSD/Kendall and MSD/MSSD). The other public schools you mentioned don’t have that much “competition.”
NYC alone has Lexington, St. Joe’s, St. Francis, and NYSD in addition to the mainstream program schools in each borough.
I lived here when MSD-Columbia was a full-service school for the deaf and remember the outcry when the recommendation was to shut it down completely and move all the students to Frederick. The fact that it’s managed to stay open all these years as a day school and serve a special needs population is a testament to the need for it.
One thing I never understood is why there was no school for the deaf in central or northern Virginia. And now VSDB Hampton is closing.
MoCo: MSD-C is not only a day program. It still has a dormitory serving 30 students (15 of both genders).
They have a full set of support staff that MSD-F has, from teachers to school counselors.
Calling it St. Joe’s was unheard of, at least in my days. St. Joseph is what everyone label it as. There’s more than 4 deaf schools you have already mentioned. There’s Cleary, Mill Neck, PS 47 American Sign Language — formerly known as PS 47 School for the Deaf where they cater only to deaf students.
Cleary, St. Francis and St. Joseph only serve deaf students up to 8th grade from the infant program and/or pre-k. On the other hand, Fanwood, Lexington and Mill Neck are available throughout the high school years. Some students from Cleary continue at Mill Neck or East Islip High School. Those from St. Francis either transfer to Fanwood, Lexington, Mill Neck (only residents of Queens or LI) or Murrow HS. As for St. Joseph, they usually go to Fanwood, Lexington or a mainstreamed program.
NY State has 11 deaf schools altogether with 3 in the upstate area. People have discussed about imagining all 7 deaf schools merge with about 150-200 or more students in each school. We’ll have the largest deaf school nationally as well as form one of the strongest academic and athletics programs. It would be one great way to bring visibility to the deaf population. The problem is no alumni or schools want to give up :)
Smile. A detail you ought to add. Add up all the numbers from all mainstreaming programs serving all districts in Orange County (fairly comparable in size with the likes of Montgomery County), you’ll realize Montgomery County’s numbers are so small to start with. Granted, Orange County doesn’t have competition to seriously consider but they do have contention of its own kind in form of turnovers caused by cost of living. We do here but not to that extent. Although known for making noises, California School for the Deaf, Riverside, still remains an afterthought in Orange’s proverbial rearview mirror. Finally, if you divide Montgomery County in districts similarly patterned after those of Orange’s, Montgomery numbers will be awfully small. Yes, many don’t don’t know about Chicago’s Whitney Young H.S. program. Why? Programs devoid of minorities get the attention. Typical prejudice. Quite educated you appear yet you don’t know about the famous Whitney Young H.S. program? How about White Station H.S. in Memphis, Tennessee. To this day I never met one person not of color from either high school. Quite ironic isn’t it?
You wrote, “(before Columbia became a day institute for deaf people with multiple disabilities)”
“Deaf people” ?!?! Isn’t it self-explanatory that the campus let alone the schools are for deaf children. Of course, I feel for you as you had to reiterate that in light of Superintendent Tucker’s pathetic proposed (officially or not–it doesn’t matter) insurance policy against the doomsday of deaf school existence especially in this hard-a** era of NCLB: mainstreaming hearing students into MSD! Inflating test scores? Yes, I checked and realized there’s Student Life Counselors at MSD-CC.
DeafSpook:
I’m curious to think about your views on Kendall’s proposed plan to also include hearing students in the first through third grade classes. This is similar to MSD’s proposal, is it not?
I know your question was directed for Deaf Spook, but I’ll put in my 2 cents’ worth anyway.
PS 47 in New York City started accepting hearing students several years ago when they thought the number of deaf students got “too small”. Result? Hearing students now outnumber deaf students at PS 47. Although the website for PS 47 makes it all sound hunky-dory and beautiful, I do wonder if Deaf people can truly keep their cultural power base in such an environment.
For that reason, I’m opposed to the idea of any school for the deaf accepting hearing students. It’s asking for trouble.
Besides, what’s wrong with going SMALL and focusing on giving the best education possible to Deaf students? Going smaller means tighter focus and when that happens, quality goes up. Spread your resources too thin, quality goes down.
Kendall Demonstration Elementary School, another mouthful of a name, is in a way paying the price of not including “Deaf” in its name. Naming is not consistent with Model Secondary School for the Deaf. Actually, I wished Gallaudet added “for the Deaf” or “of the Deaf” to Kendall School. At the same time isn’t it ironic Gallaudet (dependent on deaf school survival among others) is not “Gallaudet University of/for the Deaf” (what a hijack). I received an issue of Deaf Life with Kendall School as the cover story. Some very entertaining reading!
Also, you wrote, “institute for deaf people with multiple disabilities” — Isn’t that a mouthful. How about something more contemporary. Dignified. Are you sure you’re a native of what was the greatest County in Maryland before losers sold the county down the Potomac river leaving commoners of Howard County beaming with pride?
Just out of curiosity, what the heck does this have to do with the lawsuit against the Redskins?
Scott Van Nice started that thread…look up and you’ll see the whole chain of responses.
Similarly hijacked (read all 45 comments!) portions of this thread didn’t get this question, “why don’t you ask what the heck does this have to do with the lawsuit against the Redskins?”
Double standard.
Anyway, just to appease your psyche, I ask some of you a question. Why aren’t concerned parties boycotting everything associated with the Redskins? Boycotting all their products, services, advertisers, sponsors, FedEx and what not? I’m not a party to the lawsuit but why isn’t there a movement so visible such as picketing?
DeafSpook:
I like what you’re saying here about the deaf student demographics. This could be an entire blog in itself.
As for the increased visibility in boycotting — good point. Why not? I don’t know. I’m guessing because it’s small (3 plaintiffs), or it hasn’t generated enough momentum yet. I know of at least four other Deaf season ticket holders who aren’t on the suit. Are they aware of the suit, or are they not interested? Hmm… food for thought.
The genesis of many great movements started with one person. You’re already on your way with thrice as many. Duplication will help prevail.
The Curly R, a Redskins Blog, caught wind of this issue and has an interesting outsider take:
http://curlyr.blogspot.com/200.....-deaf.html